Anotherealm Forum - Shame on you, Stephen Hawking!

Adrienne_Ray

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Shame on you, Stephen Hawking!
Sep 11^th, 2011, 4:11pm

Open letter to Stephen Hawking:
Dear Stephen,
Shame on you ! Why did I even bother to check the spelling on your name?
Why am I perturbed?
Last month I watched "Curiosity" and saw the show about whether God is real.
Yeah, and it took me this long to write this. Forgive me, I had a hurricane and an earth quake and school starting to deal with.
A lot of people don't believe in God. That's not what I am complaining about.
Yes, Stephen, I am complaining! You have been something of a hero to me- maybe even a superhero. Heck! You've even been on the Simpsons!
The reason I am complaining is because OF THE CRAPPY SCIENCE THAT YOU USED TO PROVE IT!!!!!!!
Yes, I am yelling at you. Yes, I did say crappy.
If anybody else saw this show, please correct me if I'm wrong. But as far as I could see, Stephen Hawking said God couldn't possbly exist because He didn't cause the Big Bang. He didn't cause the Big Bang because, before the Big Bang occurred, time did not exist. Since time didn't exist, nothing could be caused because time must pass for something to happen.
Stephen, Stephen, Stephen......
Who made you the sheriff of what God can do?
God don't need no steenkin' time!
Really, y'all,
If anyone saw that show, I'd love to hear everyone's opinion on this.
From a scientific point of view, don't you think Stephen's theory is a little shabby?
I've half a mind to send him a letter and address it to Stephan Hawkings because if this is the best he's going to give us, why bother to get his name right?

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Webbie

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Re: Shame on you, Stephen Hawking!
Reply #1 - Sep 11^th, 2011, 5:21pm

Interesting.

Didn't see the show so I don't know the logic he was using. But it sounds a bit like splitting hairs. Or perhaps the old "How many angels can dance on the head of a pin"? Could God make a rock so big that even he couldn't pick it up? Etc.

I think his over simplification of it all might just be so others would understand what he was getting at. On the other hand he should know that there would be more than a few who would want a better explanation.

Then again, when it comes to time how do we know he didn't invent it?

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-W

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Gary A. Markette

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Re: Shame on you, Stephen Hawking!
Reply #2 - Sep 12^th, 2011, 1:04am

Honestly, Adrienne, you have to forgive the Hawkmeister. He, like so many other atheist scientists, is obsessed with time. And I don't blame him. It's a difficult concept. For example, while I can understand how God could have no ending (we all hope for that), I have trouble understanding how God could have no beginning. I just can't wrap my mind around that. So I fall back on something Hawking and his ilk either lack or find valueless. I fall back on Faith. When you cut away the verbiage and the bombast and the pettifogery, it's really all we have. Fortunately, it's all we need.

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Webbie YaBB Administrator Sponsor Front Page Author Offline I love AR Posts: 938 Anotherealm Gender:	Re: Shame on you, Stephen Hawking! Reply #3 - Sep 12^th, 2011, 1:02pm How far away is tomorrow? It's closer than you think. The latest animation from our One-Minute Physics series, produced by Henry Reich, looks at distance and special relativity by examining the concept in different dimensions. http://www.newscientist.com/blogs/nstv/2011/09/one-minute-physics-how-far-away-i...
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Adrienne_Ray

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Re: Shame on you, Stephen Hawking!
Reply #4 - Sep 13^th, 2011, 5:25pm

Space and time is more confusing to me than this computer.
But there is another reason why Stephen Hawking wanted to say there is no God. According to his documentary, one of his heroes is Galileo. Galileo was declared a heretic and was placed under house arrest by the Pope. Hawking seemed pleased to be declared a heretic as well. I suspect this is more about following in his hero's footsteps than making good science.

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monsoonster

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Re: Shame on you, Stephen Hawking!
Reply #5 - Sep 13^th, 2011, 10:07pm

Adrienne_Ray wrote on Sep 13^th, 2011, 5:25pm:

Galileo was declared a heretic and was placed under house arrest by the Pope.

I don't know if it is entirely appropriate to be talking god or politics on a writing board. But here it goes: Why was Galileo declared a heretic? And when you say god, what do you mean by god?

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Gary A. Markette

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Re: Shame on you, Stephen Hawking!
Reply #6 - Sep 14^th, 2011, 1:04am

Galileo was declared a heretic for espousing a heliocentric universe (rather than a geocentric one). In effect, he said--as did the Greeks hundreds of years earlier--that the earth revolved around the sun. This was anathema to the religious authorities at the time and he was threatened with a heretic's death if he didn't recant. Being sensible, if not courageous, he recanted (sort of). This was not the first nor even a very egregious example of religious fervor trumping science. It makes for interesting copy, though.

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monsoonster

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Re: Shame on you, Stephen Hawking!
Reply #7 - Sep 14^th, 2011, 7:56pm

Gary A. Markette wrote on Sep 14^th, 2011, 1:04am:

Galileo was declared a heretic for espousing a heliocentric universe (rather than a geocentric one). In effect, he said--as did the Greeks hundreds of years earlier--that the earth revolved around the sun. This was anathema to the religious authorities at the time and he was threatened with a heretic's death if he didn't recant. Being sensible, if not courageous, he recanted (sort of). This was not the first nor even a very egregious example of religious fervor trumping science. It makes for interesting copy, though.

Yes. I was wondering if Mr or Ms Ray knew because his heresy, technically, didn't have anything to do with a belief in God (as he/she seems to suggest with the Hawking comment -- Hawking maybe wantng to be a hereitic because his hero, Galileo, was one). With some people that might be splitting hairs, considering the time, but in all actuality it was because of the publication of his book ,"Dialogue Concerning the Two Chief World Systems"; which he had permission to publish beforehand -- they read it, if you are to believe history -- by the church and the Pope himself. Go figure, a book would do him in.

I also did not read the entire thread until now. The problem with Mr or Ms Ray's reaction, in my view, might be his/her hero worship of Hawking, as it were. I read a couple of Hawking's books in the 90's (and I couldn't tell you their names now to save my life). If he/she reads this post, if he/she hasn't done so already, check out both of Timothy Ferris's books, "The Coming of Age In the Milky Way" and "The Whole Shebang". Tells the whole history of physics in an understandable manner. (And I'm speaking for myself. I'm a layman) Maybe she'll find a new hero there.

Quote:

Space and time is more confusing to me than this �computer.

made me laugh. Who's going to argue with that?

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Gary A. Markette

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Re: Shame on you, Stephen Hawking!
Reply #8 - Sep 15^th, 2011, 3:55am

If you actually managed to read Hawking's stuff, I salute you. I started "A Brief History of Time" and soon surrendered to the convoluted, poorly-written, arrogant nature of it. Genius or not, the man can't write. As for hero-worship, we each choose our heroes differently. Mine has always been Bill Mazeroski. If Adrienne likes Hawking, no problem. But I bet he can't hit in the clutch like Maz.

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monsoonster

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Re: Shame on you, Stephen Hawking!
Reply #9 - Sep 18^th, 2011, 7:08pm

Gary A. Markette wrote on Sep 15^th, 2011, 3:55am:

If you actually managed to read Hawking's stuff, I salute you. I started "A Brief History of Time" and soon surrendered to the convoluted, poorly-written, arrogant nature of it. Genius or not, the man can't write. As for hero-worship, we each choose our heroes differently. Mine has always been Bill Mazeroski. If Adrienne likes Hawking, no problem. But I bet he can't hit in the clutch like Maz.

Be honest, I forget how it was written. I do remember something about black holes/radiation. One may have been "A Brief History.." (I guess it would have had to be, huh? I just looked up his publications), chances are it was, but I forget. I'll bet if I read the thing again I may feel the same way as you, as far as his writing goes. And for another, would probably feel like I was reading it for the first time. My, how time flies; and you don't need to be a physicist to understand that.

As far as heroes go, I'm not knocking it. I guess I was speaking more to her/his (I still don't know if this poster is male or female. The way panents spell children's names anymore, who knows, you know?) frustration, than anything else.

Oops. I just realized I haven't even introduced myself. Most places/sites have an introduction thread. I'll look for one instead of injecting it here.

Thanks for the talk. Have a nice day. �:)

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